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What would make a good UHD HTPC

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Jamie
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What would make a good UHD HTPC

Post by Jamie » Wed Dec 30, 2020 4:53 pm

Hi,

i am looking into buying or building a new HTPC that is UHD capable. If you have any ideas or opinions on regarding what would make a good UHD compatible HTPC and still fit in a somewhat small space please feel free to give me your advice. I would like HDMI 2.1 compatibility but not a deal breaker if it isn't 2.1 compatible. HDR and 4K a must. This will not be a gaming PC. It will be used to play movies and TV shows and other videos plus music too. 1 GB network capability would be a good start for networking too. Hard wire ethernet. Software advice would be welcomed too.

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Pauven
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Re: What would make a good UHD HTPC

Post by Pauven » Wed Dec 30, 2020 8:48 pm

Good timing, as I just went through this myself. Well, technically, still going through it.

I'm a huge AMD fan, so I prefer to buy AMD over Intel where possible. While you normally can't play 4K UHD without Intel SGX, foxy has solved that limitation for me. But...

PowerDVD 20 now officially plays non-protected 4K UHD Blu-rays (awesome!), though you still need foxy's help. But there seems to be an artificial requirement for Intel graphics for HDR!!! So far, it keeps telling me that HDR is not supported, even though my AMD PC clearly has great HDR capabilities and it works through MPC.

Since you said HDR is a requirement, and if you want access to the Blu-ray menus, then you want PowerDVD 20 on an Intel platform, specifically an Intel APU with Intel integrated graphics. I don't know which ones are powerful enough for HD 4K playback, so some research is needed here. My APU was the AMD Ryzen 3400G, a mid range previous gen APU, certainly no slouch, and while it does play 4K I can perceive a very slight jutter or skippiness to the playback, as if frames are being skipped. Since AMD GPU's, even integrated ones, are typically more powerful than Intel, this might mean you want to err on a higher end Intel CPU, at least with respect to the integrated graphics.

Hope that helps. Sorry, I don't follow Intel closely enough to recommend a specific CPU. I'm sure you could do some googling to see what other users have experienced. For the most part, I'm basically recommending you buy a NUC, just make sure it's got enough oomph for smooth playback. This also matters for using madVR filters in MPC to improve image quality - they require a bit of oomph to get the job done. My AMD CPU is lightly used, but the GPU is pegged at 100% with madVR on pretty much the lowest settings for 4K, so this should be a concern. I've ordered a Nvidia GPU to bump up the horsepower for MPC, but I don't expect it will fix PowerDVD's HDR limitation. I'll report back if it does, but the GPU is backordered a few weeks.
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Jamie
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Re: What would make a good UHD HTPC

Post by Jamie » Wed Dec 30, 2020 9:45 pm

Yes, AMD should be fine for running HDR under powerdvd. I will put a post in the foxy forum to see if they were able to work around the intel integrated graphics requirement. I know that a foxy backed up UHD disc has been able to play powerdvd with out the sgs requirement so I'll check again.

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Re: What would make a good UHD HTPC

Post by Pauven » Wed Dec 30, 2020 10:47 pm

My hunch is that HDR only working on Intel is either:

A) An Intel funded paid limitation

B) Really lazy programming

It seems a program limitation completely independent of copy protection. I don't know how PowerDVD is determining HDR capabilities, but it doesn't seem to be focused solely on HDR being enabled in Windows.

The CyberLink documentation specifically calls for Intel graphics for HDR compatibility, and this is listed separately from the Intel SGX requirement for protected disc playback.

I hope you find a solution.
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Jamie
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Re: What would make a good UHD HTPC

Post by Jamie » Thu Dec 31, 2020 3:58 pm

Hi, Happy new year!

I checked with the guys at foxy and they say that a disc that is AACS decrypted should not require sgx or intel integrated graphics chip for playing a decrypted uhd disc using powerdvd 20. In theory if the disk is decrypted than you should be able to use any CPU, GPU that is on the market. Just note that the people who responded to my question are using NVidia gpus and AMD might not be compatible based on Paul's post. A lot of people have not been using powerdvd 20 lately and there is a possibility that cyberlink my have reversed this feature in a recent release. That is just my thinking knowing that Cyberlink is capable of reversing themselves when pressure is brought to bare. Let's hope that is not true.

Jamie
Last edited by Jamie on Thu Dec 31, 2020 4:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Jamie
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Re: What would make a good UHD HTPC

Post by Jamie » Thu Dec 31, 2020 4:06 pm

Pauven wrote: Wed Dec 30, 2020 8:48 pm Good timing, as I just went through this myself. Well, technically, still going through it.

Since you said HDR is a requirement, and if you want access to the Blu-ray menus, then you want PowerDVD 20 on an Intel platform, specifically an Intel APU with Intel integrated graphics. I don't know which ones are powerful enough for HD 4K playback, so some research is needed here. My APU was the AMD Ryzen 3400G, a mid range previous gen APU, certainly no slouch, and while it does play 4K I can perceive a very slight jutter or skippiness to the playback, as if frames are being skipped. Since AMD GPU's, even integrated ones, are typically more powerful than Intel, this might mean you want to err on a higher end Intel CPU, at least with respect to the integrated graphics.

Hope that helps. Sorry, I don't follow Intel closely enough to recommend a specific CPU. I'm sure you could do some googling to see what other users have experienced. For the most part, I'm basically recommending you buy a NUC, just make sure it's got enough oomph for smooth playback. This also matters for using madVR filters in MPC to improve image quality - they require a bit of oomph to get the job done. My AMD CPU is lightly used, but the GPU is pegged at 100% with madVR on pretty much the lowest settings for 4K, so this should be a concern. I've ordered a Nvidia GPU to bump up the horsepower for MPC, but I don't expect it will fix PowerDVD's HDR limitation. I'll report back if it does, but the GPU is backordered a few weeks.
Intel NUCs are not a bad choice but I want the ability to attach more devices and maybe a bigger case. I will wait to see what intel advertises after CES.

how are you regarding Nvidea gpus. Any suggestions there?

Jamie

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Pauven
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Re: What would make a good UHD HTPC

Post by Pauven » Thu Dec 31, 2020 7:12 pm

I'm going to hold out on recommending Nvidia GPU's until I get to test one with PowerDVD 20. If HDR doesn't work, then I'm recommending pure Intel.

Please elaborate on your case requirements. What kind of expansion do you want to be able to do?

Optical drives? Full-size or Slim? How Many?

Any internal drives?

Network speeds?

What kind of devices do you plan to attach? How many?
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Jamie
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Re: What would make a good UHD HTPC

Post by Jamie » Thu Dec 31, 2020 9:03 pm

I stumbled on this case a few days ago and I was intrigued. The problem is that it would be difficult to fit a normal GPU inside

https://pcper.com/2014/11/perfect-home- ... se-review/

It takes a thin mini itx motherboard. I see a lot of great motherboards that will contain a number of connections for expansion. "usb" and SATA included. 1 GB LAN.

I found a asrock MB sorta like my unraid MB, Yes it's intel.

I'm fine with AMD unless it is not compatible with my software.

https://www.amazon.com/ASROCK-Intel-Gen ... 44&sr=8-11

I think this board lacks the thin designation.

These are mainly serving as an example. If I could have something like the top case but a little higher. That would be great. A case like a NUC but larger so that it would fit a mini ITX board plus a slim or normal GPU that would be great

I want GB ethernet for my LAN. a slim optical drive. 1 M. 2 drive . I noticed the Asrock only provides display ports. I would like HDMI 2.1 but that may not be available until July time frame.

I don't know what expansion needs I have at the moment so my desire is to have enough usb ports to add more drives. external sound card..... I always never have enough ports. Especially the NUCs really limit you. I might like a sound card but that is not a need, it's a wish at this point

As you can see I am still at the beginning of my shopping. I just started this a week ago when you mentioned getting powerdvd 20. I have been looking at cases but they seem to have cases that are 2 small or 2 big.

Jamie

I was further a long a few months ago when I mentioned that I was preparing to put together.

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Pauven
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Re: What would make a good UHD HTPC

Post by Pauven » Thu Dec 31, 2020 9:09 pm

Wow, that's an awesome case.

Big problem though. I'm pretty sure there are no friendly slot loading drives. Slim Tray are available, but those won't work in that case.

So if a friendly UHD drive is a requirement for you, I think this case is a no-go. Unless you do an external drive. But then what's the point of this case?
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Jamie
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Re: What would make a good UHD HTPC

Post by Jamie » Thu Dec 31, 2020 9:18 pm

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/ ... 6gQAvD_BwE

This case looks fine so if I can find the proper parts and maybe a cooler design it would be great. I remember you guys showing off your case design a year ago. I will have to go back to that thread to give me some ideas and direction

Jamie

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